According to your logic, Steve, all the antiwar movement should be responsible for the radicals who split off and smashed property, etc. at the last couple of SF peace marches. Should all Muslims be condemned as terrorists too?

Though it makes for a much more simplified argument process, it is wrong to insinuate that people who consider themselves "pro-life" are guilty of heinous hate crimes such as the murder of the gay youth, Matthew Sheppard.

There are plenty of "pro-lifers" who were present at the execution of Tookie Williams and who fought for his release up until that day. What about them? The only difference between some "pro-lifers" and many progressives is the disagreement between when life begins. When they finally "get it" that the life of the baby in utero is ultimately dependent on the mother up until the baby's birth, then they often finally realize that legislating mandatory birth is not the way to go. Try asking one of these people how they can force a woman to have a baby when they aren't willing or able to support that child throughout their life. That will make them think long and hard. I know this because I've actually challenged some prolifers with these very questions and they have actually CHANGED THEIR POSITION as a result. Many of them have never been challenged on these issues.

Dialogue: its a good thing.

I would also like to add that I am very suspicious of men who rabidly denounce how anti-women other groups are, wave the pro-choice flag and then do very little to help women in many, many other ways women are oppressed. I'm not saying you are this way, Steve, but I've seen a lot of men rage on about the possibility of losing choice and then turn around and insult women who are fighting all forms of oppression for women. Personally, I think it all goes together. It boils down to the commodification of women. While others think they have claims to women's uteruses --- or their vaginas, breasts, mouths and hands --- then we will never be totally liberated.